Goku Vs Sesshomaru

Well^ I want to see a response to that epicness^

Los has just been relying on the benefit of mystery; which, I have shed light on. Now we see just what Sesshomaru is capable of. It doesn't meet up to DBZ Standards.

Admin wrote:

Idiot but vegeta "turned good" just like you're saying Sesshomaru did just because he turns good doesn't mean the evil from his heart has been removed so do you see my point? and the monkey being you should remember his place also lets not forget that Just because Goku is poisoned and that specific poison affects him doesnt mean all will lets not forget that Goku has been able to go ssj while being poisoned (The heart virus) and also his body would have developed anti bodies after the fight so the poison doesnt affect him anymore also just because the strongest energies in inyuasha havent knocked sesshomaru back doesnt mean Gokus energies can't. I mean look at the part where goku goes ssj3 for the first time him just powering up was about to destroy the entire world

The evil from sesshomarus heart is more likily to be gone than vegetas, he wasn't really that evil to begin with, he just did not know compassion.In gt the fucker could not concentrate due to poisen in the air, the same poisen in the heart virus is not the same as sesshomarus shit, sesshomaru can shoot acid from his fucking hands, and with a poisenious miasma goku would not even be able to go ss.None of that would phase sesshomaru in the slightest, he is strong enough to keep himself from being forced back.

Legionary PPV wrote:

lol "AH NO EVARY THANG ABOUT DBZ OH WAIT, GOKU CAN DO DAT?" Vegeta was a good guy by the point of the Spirit Bomb threat, because the characters said so, "we wish back all of the good people that Majin Buu killed", Vegeta being one of the revived people. His heart was still not pure. And yes, maybe he can survive explosions, but not DBZ proportion explosions. The sheer force of Goku and Cell's punches were enough to destroy boulders MILES away. Now what does that tell you? And the poison aura will not affect Goku; it seems that's all you're hoping for. Goku need not transform either. The fight will be over in the blink of an eye. "OH AH NEVA SAW HIM GIT BLYNDUD SO IT MUST NAWT B PAWHSUHBAL", yeah, you keep thinking that; sad fact is it would affect him. Goku can fight blind. And the reason why Goku never bothered using his psychic-esque abilities is because his foes also had them, one such being Cell, who built the arena out of a giant, something, I don't even recall, but it was rock nonetheless. He cut the entire thing up with his mind too, into symmetrical, mathematically proportionate slabs. Why wouldn't Cell be able to do the same? I'm sure Goku's mind > Sesshomaru's. Meditation is no joke in DBZ.


Okay, upon actually doing some research, because that's what I do; I've come upon some interesting things that Los was hiding.

According to the Wiki, he's "resistant" to holy attacks, and the like. Says nothing about being immune. It says his speed is "Super Speed: Sesshomaru can move faster than the eye can see, both on land and through the air. He leaves behind a fast-moving blur and in some cases, after-images. (Though Koga might be faster in running.)[20] He can also instantaneously close long distances without being detected by others. He is capable of moving so fast that he can decapitate an entire army of samurai without they even having time to react." It also says his whip does not cut through anything, it says almost anything. And almost anything < DBZ Universe anything.

Flight: Sesshomaru has the ability to float in the sky;[17] however, in the anime, he can sometimes ride upon a sparkling dust cloud. The latter method of flight enables him to bring others along with him while flying by riding the cloud along with him.

Confirm to me he can actually fly the way say, Super Man does.

Super Strength: Sesshomaru possesses physical strength far beyond that of a normal demon; he was able to easily lift InuYasha by the throat into the air with one hand in one of their earlier encounters. In addition, Sesshomaru was seen carrying the boulder-sized demon head of Goshinki in one hand with little to no effort.[22] In the InuYasha profiles manga, Rumiko stated that Sesshomaru has Herculean strength, even with only one arm; his strength with only one arm is equal to InuYasha's full strength; InuYasha's strength allows him to lift a 9 to 10 ton boulder using one arm with little effort, so Sesshomaru would naturally be capable of lifting double that or far more with the same amount of effort.

^ Does not meet up to DBZ standards.

Senses: Due to his lineage, Sesshomaru exhibits extremely heightened senses, particularly his sense of smell. He can discern characteristics of most objects through scent, such as the undead Band of Seven through the scent of graveyard soil and pure-demon blood from half-demon blood (such as when InuYasha's demon blood takes over). Through smell alone, Sesshomaru can follow events transpiring far away or which have already transpired; for example, he learned of everything that had happened during Inuyasha's confrontation with Goshinki by simply sniffing the area in which they fought at least several hours, if not days, after the battle.[23] Besides the five basic senses, Sesshomaru's ability in sensing other's auras are exceptional.

^ Has some nice senses; but Goku has more advanced senses in other areas.

Exceptional Reflexes: Sesshomaru, with his heightened senses, also possesses astonishing reflexes, as shown when he was battling Jakotsu; he managed to deflect the latter snake-like sword at the very last second with Tokijin and even hurl it back in front of Jakotsu himself.

^ Does not confirm anything about being on DBZ level.

Teleportation: Sesshomaru can morph into a ball of energy and move himself, as well as others,[24] over great distances in a short amount of time.

^ Does not say it's as Fast As Light (FAL for future reference.)

Psionics: Though Sesshomaru's psionic capabilities have never been specifically quantified, he has demonstrated exceptionally strong and powerful feats of both telepathy and telekinesis. Examples of such being his power and ability to mentally levitate and telekinetically fly skulls at Inuyasha and Kagome,[25] and the ability to telepathically overcome Tokijin's telepathic aura.

^ Skulls do not = pyramids or giant mountain-esque bodies.

Immortality: Being a yōkai, Sesshomaru does not suffer from old age the way humans do. He appears to be around 18 to 19 years old. However, he has been around for at least over two hundred years. In the third movie, Swords of an Honorable Ruler, a flashback from the day Inuyasha was born - 200 years prior to the Sengoku Jidai - shows Sesshomaru as, physically, only a few years younger than his current appearance (with considerably shorter hair). This suggests that Sesshomaru could easily be over 400 years old or likely even 500 years old. But since the movies and specials are non canon. He could be along the lines of 200 years. In an interview Rumiko said that Sesshoumaru is more than years old.

^ Immune to death by age. (As stated before on the wiki, he is immune to disease as well.)


Regeneration: During his battle with Magatsuhi, Sesshomaru's right arm was badly injured. By beginning to transform into his daiyōkai form, the pure fighting spirit and eminence output of his demonic aura allowed Sesshomaru to completely regenerate the injuries to his right arm.[27] In the same battle, he is also able to restore his left arm, which is cut off by InuYasha at the beginning of the series.[26] Sesshomaru's body is in a continueous state of regeneration while posessing the Tenseiga. Sesshomaru was impaled also but was still able to recover instantly. However, the full extent of which Sesshomaru can regenerate his body is not shown in the series.

^ Full extent not shown.


So far I'm not impressed. :/ By the way, double posting is lame. Simply edit your post rather than double posting. kthx.


Looks like we have a winner here.

First off, you just say gokus mind is stronger because that is what you wish to believe, you cannot really compare their minds.Sesshomaru has psychic powers as well so goku could not do shit with that.Wiki told me that his greatest immunity is holy attacks, did not say shit about resistand so that is a load a crap, that's why you didn't copy and paste that exact quote, I know where you got that from.I hid nothing fool, I told you what I know from what I have read and seen, you finally decided to actually look into it which is far more than I can say for void.I never said his whip cuts through anything I was talking about the bakusaga, and his whip would fuck goku up, it contains an acidic poisen.Acid > gokus body, idk if it would pierce but it is a strong poisen it cannot be determined it if would kill him or not I doubt it would though. < dbz universe anything? Sounds like bias rambling to me, you cannot say sesshomaru couldn't do shit in dbz just because of your thuggin love for goku, just keep your fan boyism out of this and stick to facts.He flies around as a flash of light, and only needs to if he is like in a hurry.It said that inuyasha lifted a bolder with little effort and that sesshomaru with one arm could lift double of that or more with one arm with the same amount.Fact is, he could lift far more than double of that with one arm due to the fact that inuyasha was not even trying with that 10 ton bolder, meaning inuyasha could lift way more with full stregnth, not just double look at the words carefully.If with one arm he lifted a 10 ton bolder without trying, how much would it take for him to have to try with that one arm?What ever he would have to try with, he would be able to lift two times that much with two arms.Meaning that sesshomaru can lift 2 times w.e that is since one of his arms is inuyashas full stregnth.You fail math all the time so I don't expect you to solve problem very well but that's okay.Just as goku does not use his psychic powers much, sesshomaru does not either, the full limits to his abilities are not shown, he does not rely on such weak tactics because they are "beneith him".Full extent wasn't shown because sesshomaru owned every character in inuyasha by a certain point, even before bakusaga.You didn't even read up the shit on bakusaga I like how you avoided it and the specifics of some of his moves.You only showed the underwelming whip of light which could still be used to knock goku away.It said he was impaled and healed, his arm regenerated, what more do you need to be shown?The fact is, the bakusaga makes contact with goku once (or if one of its waves or w.e go) goku's body will decompose immediatly.You have not won, you can act as cocky as you like, the fact is sesshomaru can rape goku in an instant, get over your little fucked up religion of worshipping fictional characters, the real god doesn't like that.

I didn't post the stuff about his backo whatever because the article was too long, and nothing in it was of paramount importance. And on the Wiki, it says one of his abilities is "Immunity" which they go right away to mentioning the fact that he is IMMUNE to disease and such. It says directly " His greatest resistance seems to be toward holy and divine powers;". Resistance does not = immunity. Resist = to go against, hinder, or delay an opposing force or ailment. Immunity = completely unaffected by such. It's natural to allocate resistances in the same area of immunities because they both are things that are less effective on him (immunities having no effect at all).

I like how you think everything you state is able to affect Goku when in fact they are likely to have little to no effect in any regards to his abilities simply due to the fact that Goku's raw resilience is just too unfathomable for you to perceive.


I can play pictures, too.

Oh yea it is of no importance because it can fuck goku up.And they say my logic is retarded.Oh yes, what they show in the series it too much for me to comprehend even though it is explained.OOOOH GOKU CAN SURVIVE DECOMPOSING, HE CAN FIGHT EVEN WHEN HE IS DEAD WHOOOOOOOO.Poisen dragon nurfed him by filling the air with poisen, sesshomaru can do the same thing so ggs.Your resiliance means nothing since you cannot gather ki and needed your godamn grandaughter to help you fight the weakest of the dragons, yet you can beat an over powered ass demon who can kill you in one hit.Sesshomaru is around as strong as goku as much as you don't want to believe this, your irrational attachment to goku makes you come up with stupid arguements such as "goku will find a way to win he always does" instead of giving facts.Oh and your famous line "your an idiot because you don't think goku can beat everyone like I do, if you don't think the same way as me your a retard and your logic is flawd *fails to give reason as to how and makes up some shit later*"Leave your fanboyism out of this and state some damn facts honkey.

And just how you claim how everything about goku is beyond comprehention, the same could be said for sesshomaru since he never even tries with the enemies he fights, the characters in inuyasha are far to weak, it would take some dbz shit to actually give him a chalenge.He has only lost to inuyasha because he turned into a giant dog making himself a giant target and he didn't even have a sword back then.Most of his attacks would effect goku, could goku take some fucking acid claws to the eyes?Sesshomaru got stabbed in his fucking eye iirc and that shit healed.You have given me no facts as to how he is not dbz level, the fucker is too good for his own series he is in, no one has ever even put up a decent fight against him while armed.Only inuyasha has ever beaten him and that's because inuyasha has a fucking over powered one hit kill sword and sesshomaru had either no sword, or only one fucking arm.

I am stating the facts. You are merely shoving your opinions down
everyone's throats as "factual information", despite the mere logical
conclusion that can be drawn by even the most simple person, that Goku
is superior in nearly every way because he's----
1: Faster
2: Stronger
3: Has more abilities and many tricks up his sleeve
4: The wiser fighter
5: Has training of which the likes no other character has been put through.
6: Has the ability to perpetually draw on his unconquerable spirit to
defeat any foe no matter what the price by finding some weakness or flaw
in the opponent's fighting style.

7: King Kai warns him of what opponents have, giving him an unforeseen
advantage against the opponent. And you can't say "oh dat cheating"
'cause King Kai is basically Goku's Navi, except, King Kai is to Navi as
Goku is to Link; aka vastly superior in his area of expertise; this one
being wisdom. This is one advantage that is almost always overlooked,
yet King Kai gives Goku some heads up or some kind of advice in nearly
every fight (after he is introduced as a character at least.)


Goku's pretty much seen it all, and he's fought the best of the best.
Sesshomaru can't even begin to say he's fought the best of the best,
because the best in his universe are Dragon Ball level at best, which,
Goku outgrew a long, long time ago.

I left out the information about his sword because they are not menacing
to him at all. There's nothing battle-changing about them at all. I'd
like to see Sesshomaru even get near Goku while he's powering up; the
energy Goku was releasing was so great, it shook the entire Earth upon
transforming into SSJ3, it created hurricane winds; even blowing Goten
and Trunks away.

According to the Wiki; Sesshomaru's reflexes, speed, and strength, all
pale in comparison to that of our Champion, Goku. In fact, as I stated
before, just the force of Goku's fists hitting against the air was
enough to obliterate boulders miles away from where the punch was
launched; and that was just in ascended Super Saiyan. Imagine what SSJ2
would do. And as for the poison; just because it happened against one
person, does not mean it will happen again. Goku's body has become more
resistant thanks to natural biological processes that Void mentioned;
antibodies; increasing his resistance to poisons. And who's to say the
poison was the same as the one the Dragon had? Maybe the Dragon had a
specific poison that Goku was weak against; it was never stated. You
cannot bring up that idea considering Sesshomaru has never been shown to
have a poisonous aura that has disrupted anyone's ki-channeling
abilities before; or any kind of mental assimilation; now has it? I
didn't think so. I rest my case, and Goku shall inevitably be declare
the undisputed winner of this battle, except, one opposer is preventing
it from being unanimous.






He'll always be waiting for the next threat. When the time comes, he will return with a...






















Surprise...

I am shoving things down peoples throats?Your the one just automatically assuming that goku is superior in every way, you have no facts to support it.You have no idea how fast sesshomaru is, goku would have to get near sesshomaru to fight him because ki blasts do not work.King kai does not inform him absolutely every time, and would not know of a foe from an alternate universe.Sesshomaru has went to the christian version of hell and back, goku has that fucking fairy hell with those stupid looking ogres.You don't know what other characters have been put through, sesshomaru has lived for hundreds of years, yet you assume goku has had more training?Dragon ball at best?You never seen the entire series and it is dragon ball at best?You have nothing but presumptuous bull shit, no logic, no facts."GOKU STRONGER, GOKU FASTER, GOKU HAVE BIGGER PENIS SO HE WEEN" that's the basis of your arguement.Wiki said specifically goku has better reflexes?Oh and wtf, any poisen can stop him from concentrating, he wasn't poisened by that dragon, it polluted the area making it where he could not concentrate his ki, for a dbz fanatic you seem to know shit, or maybe that is due to your short attention span and habit of assuming all your facts(which is why you failed math btw).Doesn't have to be the same kind, they didn't say there was a same kind, the fact is the area was polluted and the air was polluted, and that messed with his ability to gather ki somehow, he wasn't poisened.He might have developed anibodies from the poisen in dbz but that doesn't matter against a more powerful poisen, and it matters even less when the fucking area is covered in a poisenious miasma since it stopped goku in his tracks in gt.It wasn't a special kind of poisen that blocks ki, the area was polluted, and when the air is polluted goku cannot gather energy, that is what was said in that episode, simple as that.Defeat any foe and find flaws in their fighting style?According to that logic sesshomaru has more energy and power than anyone.You didn't look up the shit for baku saga because it would one hit kill goku, he cannot take a hit from it and he could lose.Sesshomaru is just as fast if not faster, and goku himself even proved that speed didn't matter since the nova dragon outsped him even though he used instant transmission, but he still won.Wiser fighter?Okay so dude who is like 60 or something by gt is a wiser fighter than a 500 year old demon, I don't think you know what experince is, there are a lot of simple words you need to look up before you continue.Draw an unconqurable spirit, even naruto has that.Lot of the demons from inuyasha are dbz level, they may not be speedy or shoot giant beams everwhere, but they are still deadly as well as strong.You have no idea the limits of sesshomarus stregnth, since it is never really shown.Gokus stregnth is emphasized on throughout the show, lot of what sesshomaru can do were not shown, and every fight he has been in, he was either nurfed, or had to hold back so he would not accidently kill people he cared about.

Btw, it is never shown if he develops anibodies strong enough to become immune to that poisen or all poisens, that is just some assumption you made up.

For the record Los you've had me read Sesshomarus abilities at wiki many times so yeah.

Yea I did but you and your short attention span only comprehended that he lost to inuyasha and that's it.You know nothing about his abilities you just say he can't beat goku and give no reason for it, no comparison of stregnth, no rhyme or reason as to how he can't win other than "GOKU DESTROYS PLANETS, GOKU FASTA, GOKU SMATA, GOKU A SUPA DUPA SAIYAN".

Okay Los, I'm going to end it here, because you're completely ignoring the facts I've laid out. You bluntly say I don't know shit about his capabilities, yet I've stated what he is capable of doing, and it doesn't match up to the Z fighter standards. Nothing Sesshomaru can do is a threat to Goku. Goku is blatantly faster, stronger, and more flexible in a myriad of aspects. And age does not = wisdom. Age and Wisdom are not always linked to time in the aspect that the longer you live, the wiser you are. You can have a 500 year old man with no formal education figure out many facts about life, or say, for this example, mathematical formulas since you want to bring math into this subject; then you can have a 24 year old scholar, who reads up on these things via text books, or many other sources, and from experience as well, and be easily smarter than the 500 year old man. Case closed. You lose, and you always will.



^ Can't touch Buu, so stop saying he can, k? With your bias, ignoring information others have posted. "OH IT SAYZ GOKU IS AS FAST AS A JET, BUT SESSHOMARU IS AS FAST AS A TRAIN, BUT DAT DONT MATTA SESSHOMARU IZ FASTA N STRONGA N BETTA N DA BESS EVA AH GAY FO HIM AH JUST WANT TO GO AGAINST GOKU BECUZ HE DA BESS N AH DONT LIK HIM GITTIN AWW DA CREDIT FO BEIN DA BESS BECUZ AHMA THROW IN SHITTY CHARACTERZ DAT CANT HOLD A CANDLE 2 HIM CUZ DAT WUT AH DO BEZT YE DIGG"

I know gokus capabilities and sesshomarus.Yes you stated his abilities and just because you say they are not dbz standard does not make it true.Sesshomaru does after images, just like goku, sesshomaru has a form of transportation not as fast as gokus but just fine since he cannot really be hit in such a state.With baku saga, one cut and goku is down, I am pretty sure at his speed he would cut goku once and win.Goku has no edgucation and you think he is smarter than any fictional character so I don't see your logic here with the formal edgucation.If you've lived for 500 years you know a lot more about life than someone who was edgucated formally, maybe not as much about certain things when it comes to math or other studies but you definitly know more about life, the scholar is just edgucated but does not have as much life experince.The fact of the matter is, goku cannot gather ki with poisened air, and he would get hit by sesshomaru and die, you lose, plain and simple.




"I'M A STUPID ASS HONKEY, GOKU CANNOT LOSE TO ANYONE, I MUST COPY WHAT LOS SAID ABOUT MY ARGUEMENT AND ACCUSE HIM OF THE SAME THING BECAUSE I AINT LETTING NO NIGGER PROVE ME WRONG, I WOULD RATHER DIE BEFORE I ADMIT THAT.SESSHOMARU MAYBE ABLE TO DECOMPOSE PEOPLE IN ONE HIT BUT LET ME JUST IGNORE THE BAKUSAGA SECTION BECAUSE IT WOULD OWN MY ENTIRE ARGUEMENT, I'D RATHER NOT GET ON A TOPIC I CANNOT WIN.I'MMA JUST SAY GOKU IS BETTER IN EVERY WAY WITHOUT KNOWING THE FULL EXTENT OF SHIT BECAUSE I REFUSE TO BELIEVE THAT GOKU COULD LOSE TO ANYONE AT ALL EVER.GOKU IS STRUNGA BECAUSE I SAY SO AND THAT'S FINAL I WIN, I WIN I WIN I WIN I WIN YOU LOSE YOU CAN NEVER BEAT MY REASONING THAT WHAT I SAY IS LAW, FOR I AM THE FURIOUS BI CURIOUS"

Well Los like I've said itachi has the same ability with his sword and we all know itachi can't beat goku

Sesshomaru can do it long ranged though, and he is far faster than itachi.

Los itachi is far ranged too and with susano'o he has greater defense which makes up for him not being so fast and lets not forget he has Amaterasu which follows you and look in his eyes and you fall under an illusion

Bakusaga would break through it, the only thing it never broke was the shikon jewel and that's because that is the only thing more demonic than anything in the series.I think his illusions only work on people who are far weaker like naruto since itachi fought many others and they did not auto fall under an illusion, naruto was just inexperinced sakura apparently knew better than to look at him in the eyes.Kakashi didn't fall under an illusion when he fought him, sasuke didn't, karin, and osuma didn't, and itachi was scared to fight jaraya so wtf.

As I said Los, he is not fast enough to keep up with Goku. The difference is astronomical. And yes, Goku did have education, if you would pay attention to the series a bit better; as Master Roshi educated him, and Krillin when they were Turtle Hermits. Maybe you need to just admit defeat already, since you fail at understanding ANY kind of logic. Goku would be able to end this battle in a split second. And as I was saying before, say, for example, there were many 500 year old men, and some of them wrote BOOKS and DOCUMENTED their studies/findings/occurrences. A person who studies that is going to learn everything that person labored for 500 years, in a matter of 2-3 years at MOST depending on how long the book is. So being older does not necessarily mean being smarter. k? You understand? Need a quote from someone who is qualified in the manners of philosophy? Well, here you go "Employ your time in improving yourself by other men's writings so that you shall gain easily what others have labored hard for." ~ Socrates. Now go sit down with a drum stick in one hand, and a banana in the other and figure out what that means Fat Thinker #3.

The fact is you do not know the limit of sesshomarus speed and from what wiki says it is on dbz level.Goku was slower than nova dragon and still won.Your the one who needs to shut up and give up already since you freaking lost, sesshomarus sword kilsl him in one hit, goku cannot hurt sesshomaru except with punches and he has no way of approaching him, he would either have acid slashed into his body or get cut by baku saga if he comes anywhere near sesshomaru.You are irrational as fuck and telling me about understanding logic.The experince we speak of is about fighting experince which you do not learn in any book.Sesshomaru has fought far longer than goku did and with all his demonic power he could easily chase goku down with a wave from his bakusaga and wound him.One hit = dead goku get over it.Get past your gay love for a fictional character that you jerk off to posters of on your ceiling, you should be selling all your goku shit for some food for you family like a good little hillbilly.

Give me one example of it being DBZ speed. Go, right now.

Los you've told me before that sesshomaru isn't as powerful as goku (strength wise) yet you always say "Strength >> training" so I see a contradiction

Void, I said that ONCE and it was because I misread something I already told you this.Bigedo, sesshomaru they said on the wiki in some cases moves in after images, the reason it is sometimes is due to the fact that the enemies in inuyasha are shit weak compared to him that whenever he used after image he actually had to try somewhat.Him decapitating that army in a flash is an example, it doesn't show how fast he moves it like showed that streak in the bg like it does in pokemon but he has to be moving dbz speeds to cut off all their heads in less than a second.When he first fights inuyasha he even toys with him, he could have killed him and they showed how he outsped inuyasha but he could have gone much faster.He doesn't use after image all the time because unlike gokus enemies speed and power is not the best course of action, in fact in most of sesshomarus fights in the series he had to hold back or else he would kill allies or his 4 year old girl friend.There is not ANYONE in the series who sesshomaru couldn't just demolish at will, he was only beaten by inuyasha because he made himself a bigger target, and the second time he only had one arm and no sword to fight with.Lot of sesshomarus power is not fully determined, but what is known is that when he actually puts any sort of effort into his fighting, he is capable of moving at dbz level speeds.
Wiki said it somewhere idk if you read it but he can brethe in space to, it is shown in inuyashas second ending him flying around the earth.Goku had to keep up with his enemies to beat them in a fight because his enemies were basically strong and powerful like him for the most part.Sesshomarus enemies were mostly demons he slaughtered in an instant, or some other demon with a powerful barrier to keep itself from being hurt by sesshomaru (before he got bakusaga a barrier was a problem) the only thing shown to not be destroyed by bakusaga is the shikon jewel which cannot be destroyed by anyone but kagome or kikyo (kikyo dies).Fact is even with slight effort he used after image and if he were fighting a worthy opponent (are none in inuyasha) he would move even faster, idk if he is as fast or faster than goku, either way goku proved you can be slower and still win, he is in gokus legue in speed and don't bring up how hercule used after image because sesshomaru could man handle his ass unarmed, hercule cannot lift tons of weight he is nowhere near sesshomarus stregnth.Btw goku does not move at the speed of light unless he is using instant transmission, the space ship moving through outer space only moved at light speed probably when blasting off, in space it obviously slows down or else why would balma's ship slow down eventially when it gets at a decent enough speed to make it to namek in time.Also why would goku be using instant transmission to keep up with nova shinron if he already moves at the speed of light?Your exaggerating his abilities greatly, yes he is strong, yes he can destroy planets, but he does not move at the speed of light.

http://media.animevice.com/uploads/0/9491/243020-kid_goku_faster_than_lightning_1_super.gif
Goku was able to dodge lightning toward the end of Dragon Ball, (this was before he took on the appearance of "Adult" Goku, too.) The pic was not given, but it has been done already.

"Lightspeed shunkan ido is dub line filler. I don't know how many times I
have had to continually point this out. Shunkan Ido is INSTANT. It can
travel throughout dimensions (earth to afterlife, Enma's to Kaioshin's)
instantly. So to some up, Instant Transmission is Instant, it is a fail
dub script change that makes it lightspeed-in which case Radditz moves
faster than IT.

Goku is lightning fast as a child to pass
popo's test, lightning can be 1/2 speed of light, goku routinely dodges
beams that have been clocked ftl or lightspeed (moon busts, vegeta's
final flash) so its clear fighting speed>>>>>travelling
speed, similarly in a fight bruce lee would be faster than usane
bolt. But as I said, even using the mach 17 on snake way, and 5000
plv correlation you can prove he becomes ftl with some
math. lightspeed= mach 880, 000 therefore goku was (880,000/17) 51764x
slower than light at this point that means theoretically he needs to
be pvl (51764x 5000) 258 823 529, now his pvl when he FIRST turned ssj
was 150 000 000 (official, in daizenshu) so its clear he surpasses the
lightspeed threshold for travelling speed.(again combat speed is faster)
This also assumes a linear relationship between pvl and speed, more
likely (based on the fact it took goku a month to run snake way with pvl
>1200, then two days with pvl 5000) it is a exponential
relationship, meaning he would be much faster much quicker. And again
his combat speed is even much faster. now to clear something up, IT
(shunkan ido) is instant, not lightspeed. It is a dub line and filler
that says lightspeed, in the manga and based on feats IT=instant
movement." Combat Speed > Travel Speed IT = instant

"Vegito was suggested to have the ability to move faster than light speed, considering that he told Super Buu that he had to feel the movement of his ki because he wouldn't be able to see him with his eyes."

Goku does indeed move FTL in Dragon Ball Z using Instant Transmission.



According to Bulma, it would take 4339.2516 years to get to Namek... light years... :/ Goku gets there in an instant using IT, proving IT is FTL. A light year is the distance light travels in a year. Don't believe my word on this? "A unit of astronomical
distance equivalent to the distance that light travels in one year,
which is 9.4607 × 1012 km (nearly 6 trillion miles)" It didn't take Goku 4339.2516 years to get to Namek, did it? Or did time just stay still while Goku teleported to Namek. You tell me.



The new ship Goku used to reach Namek was flying faster than the speed of light considering it reached it in about five days. King Kai was able to communicate with Goku while he was on the ship; yet he was unable to communicate with Goku while he was fighting against Frieza, saying they were moving much too fast for him to communicate.

Oh, FYI; creating an afterimage is no big deal as Goku was able to do it as early as DRAGON BALL. And lets not forget our friend here... Looks like you were right about Masta being fast. He's also a good cook.

Oh goku is faster than I thought, can't really blame me since I am going by the dub description, they said instant transmission moves at light speed.Idk sesshomarus limits since they are never shown but either way his poisen would make goku useless, I mean if goku needed his grand daughters help for that weak ass dragon just because it polluted the air, sesshomaru would own him in an instant.Win the arguement with the poisen factor and I will admit you won however idk sesshomarus speed limits but I am not going to assume something that is not there.

Well Los not knowing sesshomarus limits is the same as us saying not knowing gokus by the end of GT and los didn't bob show you that goku travels to space in DB? and thats the posion of some "god" dragon not all poison will work on goku the same way that one did and you say that you think GT is not canon so im confused? If you think its not canon how can it be part of your argument?

Lordlos wrote:

Oh goku is faster than I thought, can't really blame me since I am going by the dub description, they said instant transmission moves at light speed.Idk sesshomarus limits since they are never shown but either way his poisen would make goku useless, I mean if goku needed his grand daughters help for that weak ass dragon just because it polluted the air, sesshomaru would own him in an instant.Win the arguement with the poisen factor and I will admit you won however idk sesshomarus speed limits but I am not going to assume something that is not there.

Even if the poison was a factor; which is highly unlikely, Goku could end the battle extremely quickly. He can teleport into an area Sess cannot detect, create two stationary ki blasts, and launch them at different times as a distraction, and teleport behind him immediately, resulting in a free shot as done against Frieza. (Goku did not have IT at that time either.)

"Haze Shenron: Why not? Humankind is doing that on its own anyway, isn't it? I'm only going to speed up the process and kill the Earth more efficiently. Polluting the planet is my sole reason to be. My poison is unstoppable. It spreads like a disease, sucking the life out of creation. Let it live, so that all may perish. (Haze Shenron blasts Goku and Pan into a rock) Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Aha ha. What do you think of Haze Shenron now? Do you still think I'm weak?
Goku: Definitely. Your evil deeds are the poison that makes you weak.
Haze Shenron: Well, a philosopher. What do ya know. Perhaps you'll better understand the depth of my power at the bottom of the lake."

So it appears Haze Shenron's poison has the rather unique special attribute of "sucking the life" out of something, in a similar manner to the way the Androids and Cell were able to.

"Physically speaking, Haze Shenron is the weakest of the Shadow Dragons, to the point where Pan was able to completely dominate him by herself. However, his trump card is the pollution he causes, which makes his opponents weaker with time, so while he remains relatively weak when it comes to scouter readings, his opponents getting weaker while he remains the same until his oponents are weaker than him. However, his pollution has no effect on non-organic beings, such as the Machine Mutant Giru."

"Flight – The ability to fly with the use of ki.

Haze Shenron's rainbow Mouth Blast
Added by Jeangabin666
Pollution – The ability to pollute an area, which slowly weakens the energy of people until they are powerless.
Mouth Energy Wave – Haze fires a rainbow beam of energy from his mouth.
Afterimage Technique – A technique that uses short bursts of extreme high speed movement, that moves faster than the opponent can sense. This has the side effect of leaving a momentary "after image", until the opponent's senses adapt and realize their target has moved."

His specific type of poison is an extremely potent kind of poison, with the special ability to as stated above "suck the life" out of living things. We all live with some kind of pollution around us; as did the people of Earth in the Z universe; however, his pollution is an extremely potent form with a special ability that draws the energy out of its victims. No other pollution has been seen creating this kind of effect on any warrior or environment except Destron Gas from Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans; which obviously Sesshomaru does not produce Destron Gas.

"Haze Shenron - Haze Shenron is the Dragon of Pollution. He uses his powers to create a muggy fog that settles over the land and drains any person coming into contact with it of all their power and energy. He was born when Goku used the Dragon Balls to wish Bora back to life many years ago. Dragon of the 2 star ball."

Goku is not weak to any particular kind of poison or element unless the specific element specifically mentions a special attribute, this, being that it drains the energy of any living beings that draw near.


And about the dub issue; that has thrown me off a few things on a few occasions. Just be proud that you didn't say "OH HERP A DERP DA AMERUCAN ANUHMAY IZ MOAR AKYOURUHT DEN DA JAPANESE MANGA" ~ Anonymous African Scientologist whom resides in California.